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 Map 21 - Chapel of Ghouls (by Adrian Hanekom, Rauno Marks and [WH]-Wilou84)

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franckFRAG
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[WH]-Wilou84
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I've started working on this, hopefully all my edits can be finished within a fortnight.
Plenty of varied and interesting shapes, something I'm unable to do on my own maps. Having a blast working on it Smile

Slot 22 will be perfect for it, thanks Franck !
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Je viens d'éditer mon post, si tu veux avoir une idée de la map version NT Smile

Edit, ah tu y travaille dessus, peut-être veux-tu que je t'envois la map retexturée? Il s'agit seulement de remplacement de texture, il n'y a pas de modification de secteur.


Dernière édition par franckFRAG le Dim 19 Avr 2015, 21:24, édité 1 fois
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[WH]-Wilou84
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Cool, j'aime ce vert Wink

Il nous manquait effectivement pas mal de textures de marbre vert dans le wad de ressources ( tout ce qui est têtes de lion etc. ), c'est bien de les avoir ajoutées !

Par contre, si on bosse tous les deux en même temps sur cette map, ça ne va pas servir à grand chose.
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franckFRAG
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Héhé, oui j'ai été surpris de ne pas voir de texture de marbre vert dans le wad ressource, c'est un comble! Sinon, ba oui ça risque d'être problématique de bosser à deux dessus xD Je ne sais pas où tu en es, mais comme je l'ai dis à mon post au dessus, j'ai seulement fais du "find and replace". Je pense qu'il vaut mieux que je t'envoie la map, le remplacement de texture m'a pris 10 minutes Smile
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[WH]-Wilou84
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franckFRAG a écrit:
Héhé, oui j'ai été surpris de ne pas voir de texture de marbre vert dans le wad ressource, c'est un comble! Sinon, ba oui ça risque d'être problématique de bosser à deux dessus xD Je ne sais pas où tu en es, mais comme je l'ai dis à mon post au dessus, j'ai seulement fais du "find and replace". Je pense qu'il vaut mieux que je t'envoie la map, le remplacement de texture m'a pris 10 minutes Smile
Eh bien, j'ai ajouté 300 secteurs sur la map pour le moment...
J'imagine que ces nouvelles textures seront dans le prochain wad de ressources ? Smile
Si oui, je peux attendre que ce wad soit prêt, et faire un "Find & Replace" comme tu l'as fait.
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Je viens t'envoyer le dernier wad ressource et la map pour te donner une idée Smile
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[WH]-Wilou84
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Merci à toi, c'est très joli !
Je vais voir comment je peux ajouter plus de vert du coup Wink

_________________
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Il est complice.

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Hello Wilou!

[WH]-Wilou84 a écrit:
I'm partial to not having a way to lower the pillar to the Berserk if it's raised too much. It means that you can fail to get the secret and not be able to reach it any more.
But it's my only gripe, and a very minor one, so it's fine Smile
You're kind of right about it being able to be raised too much, but I like it and it makes it a secret kind of. That quirkiness makes it quite a unique and almost 'puzzle' secret that makes you go 'aha!' and gives the room a little character. ;P
That area was actually designed by Rauno Marks. I've already deleted a ton of his stuff already,  so maybe we can keep that? I don't want him to hate me even more Razz

[WH]-Wilou84 a écrit:
Ok, so I have a couple questions for you here Mr. Hanekom Smile

1) What is your idea regarding the ending of the map ?
As I see it, there are three keys you can gather in any order you like ( which is great ), and also a red door and a blue door. Haven't seen a Yellow door, was it supposed to be included as the exit door or something after some switches are activated behind Blue and Red doors ?
I had an idea but I think it's really an unepic and generic way to finish the level off, given that I ran out of space there... if you have any ideas feel free to join them somehow, as long as we keep the map kind of short and sweet. Smile

[WH]-Wilou84 a écrit:

2) Do you have any speedrunning tricks in mind for this map, or even a UV Speed route ?
I never have ideas for tricks to be honest, I'm useless when it comes to speedrun tricks, so I just focus on UV max haha. Dunno, feel free to add some if you can find any. Smile

PS: I'm glad you're enjoying working on the map! :>

Cheers everyone, have a great week
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deathevokation a écrit:
That area was actually designed by Rauno Marks. I've already deleted a ton of his stuff already,  so maybe we can keep that? I don't want him to hate me even more Razz
Haha, okay, no worries there, it's definitely gonna stay in. Smile
Observant players will surely figure it out anyway.

As for speedrunning tricks, the least we could do is allowing a glide at the red bars, so that the player would only need two out of three keys.

Working on the YK part at the moment. I'm trying to make something as fast-paced and entertaining as the other two key parts, we'll see how it goes !
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Cool Smile
I'm really looking forward to seeing what you come up with, and I really like the idea of every mapper doing a different route, dunno if that's ever been done before on a 3 man collaboration? Razz
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J'ai terminé mes petites modifications sur cette map. Cool

Changelog :
- Ajout du passage vers la clé jaune : un peu de caverne et de marbre
- Ajout d'un passage de fin, avec un piège
- Quelques tricks sont permis pour la route d'UV Speed : glide + Rocket Jump ( et on n'aurait besoin que de la clé bleue avec cette route )
- Des monstres et des items ont été rajoutés pour le mode Co-op
- Un peu de détail a été rajouté ici et là

D'un point de vue gameplay, l'idée générale est la même : le Cyberdémon est une menace qui ne pourra pas être éliminée avant que l'on trouve d'autres passages et suffisamment de ressources.
Un petit piège a été ajouté à la toute fin de la map, histoire d'échauffer un peu les joueurs avant les grosses maps de l'épisode 3.

Pour le thème, je suis resté assez fidèle à l'esprit de la map de base, tout en mettant de la peinture "nécrotique" un peu partout.... Smile

Je suis en train de tester le mode Co-op avec PrBoom en -solo-net.

Je peux vous envoyer la map si vous voulez Wink


deathevokation a écrit:
[...] I really like the idea of every mapper doing a different route, dunno if that's ever been done before on a 3 man collaboration? Razz
Hehe, well I think it's been done yeah, a 4-people collab map called "Quadruple Threat", by Jodwin, 40oz, The Green Herring and Super Jamie Smile
Each author had a dedicated section of the map.
http://www.doomworld.com/idgames/index.php?file=levels/doom2/Ports/p-r/qthreat.zip

I could send you the updated version of "Chapel of Ghouls" if you'd like to see how I tortured your map Smile
But maybe it would be wiser to wait until your exams are over !
You tell me. Smile

_________________
Un peuple qui élit des corrompus, des renégats, des imposteurs, des voleurs et des traîtres n'est pas victime !
Il est complice.

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Cool! And thanks for finishing it, man!

I guess it's better to just send it to me now because otherwise I'll be thinking of this map during the exam haha, but send it ASAP! Smile

I can't type long messages because I'm power studying so I'll be able to give you a general 'yay!' or 'nay!' haha

Maybe at some point I can add even more stuff... not extend routes, but just optional areas and stuff, I had some ideas last time I tried it out. Razz

But really, thank you!
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deathevokation a écrit:
I guess it's better to just send it to me now because otherwise I'll be thinking of this map during the exam haha, but send it ASAP! Smile
Haha ok, fine then, check your mailbox Cool

_________________
Un peuple qui élit des corrompus, des renégats, des imposteurs, des voleurs et des traîtres n'est pas victime !
Il est complice.

George Orwell
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Lovely work man, really! Thanks a lot, you've done a great job! I'll give you more extensive feedback when I'm done with my exam, seriously, I need to stop coming here, my next post will be when I've finished my exam haha. There are some things I'd like to change, but we'll talk about that after I'm done and I have a clear mind. The only thing I can think of right now is the marble / metal door of this texture wad being used in the opening room, it'd set a nice dramatic tone for the rest of the map and add character to the room. Razz
http://www.doomworld.com/vb/wads-mods/72609-gothics-boredom-inc-textures/

But a quick question, what are the permissions of the Requiem music? I think the level needs a track that's slightly less all over the place.... busy detailing + busy music can become overwhelming. Smile

ps; you forgot to credit Rauno Marks for the red key route. Mad
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deathevokation a écrit:
I need to stop coming here, my next post will be when I've finished my exam haha.
xD
Easier said than done :p

I wish you success.

As for permission on Requiem music, you may use its midis as long as due credit is given.
I grow fond of the midi you used in Chapel of Ghouls though, goes very well with such a dark and scary place. Smile

deathevokation a écrit:
ps; you forgot to credit Rauno Marks for the red key route. Mad
?
His name is "written" on the automap credits as well. Cool

_________________
Un peuple qui élit des corrompus, des renégats, des imposteurs, des voleurs et des traîtres n'est pas victime !
Il est complice.

George Orwell
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deathevokation
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Ohhh... I guess Zdoom automap doesn't zoom that far out then.. anyway, what do you think of that marble door texture in the link I sent you? Smile
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deathevokation a écrit:
Ohhh... I guess Zdoom automap doesn't zoom that far out then.. anyway, what do you think of that marble door texture in the link I sent you? Smile
It's a great texture yeah Cool
Although it doesn't really seem like a door to me. More like a decorative panel.
I believe that if you replace the door texture by this marble one, maybe it would be best to have a lowering floor instead of a door, that would lower once and for all when the player makes his way forward.

It would also make the Cyber much more effective, since it would reduce the cover in the starting area.

What do you think ? Smile

_________________
Un peuple qui élit des corrompus, des renégats, des imposteurs, des voleurs et des traîtres n'est pas victime !
Il est complice.

George Orwell
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Maybe it lowers to 8 units above highest floor when you activate it? That way you can pretend it's a wall, and I'll pretend it'd a door. haha Razz
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deathevokation a écrit:
Maybe it lowers to 8 units above highest floor when you activate it? That way you can pretend it's a wall, and I'll pretend it'd a door. haha Razz
Okay, yeah it's fine !

_________________
Un peuple qui élit des corrompus, des renégats, des imposteurs, des voleurs et des traîtres n'est pas victime !
Il est complice.

George Orwell
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Oh and to address, an earlier point;

[WH]-Wilou84 a écrit:

As for permission on Requiem music, you may use its midis as long as due credit is given.
I grow fond of the midi you used in Chapel of Ghouls though, goes very well with such a dark and scary place. Smile

I was also fond of the midi, but maybe I listened to it too much, and it's kind of nice to play the map at your own pace... dunno, haha... another reason for using a entirely different midi, I wanted something with church organs that helped bring the chapel atmosphere forth, so that the name 'Chapel of Ghouls' could fit a bit better, instead of vaguely fitting the the main room.

I actually found something that's very atmospheric that was written for a lesser known 96 wad, or atleast it's lesser know now.... it's kind of a bonus because it's always nice to have a midi from something (as well as getting one composed etc) that the average Doomer hasn't heard... makes the map more unique and an entirely new experience instead of bringing up memories of the another map with the same midi. But I think I'm preaching to the choir, haha.

Anyway... try resist replying until the 6th, haha... so that I don't feel obsessive compulsive about responding, haha.
tongue

All the best, man. Smile
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Well... I wrote my exam and I feel like I've failed, damn, going to waste another 6 months of my life, the thing is that I knew everything and even if I had to rewrite I still wouldn't have finished... because of the fact that you have to write so much in such a little time... as someone who has seizures and takes medication that makes my brain slower I don't think I'm mentally capable of finishing. Sad

Anyway, with that out the way... I think I'm going to play around with the texturing / layout a bit with my route a little bit... not sure when though.

I think I preffered having the lost souls descend from the bars in the one trap to be honest, because they're ghosts so they can move through things. Razz

Hope everything's going well with everyone!
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deathevokation a écrit:
Well... I wrote my exam and I feel like I've failed,
Argh that sucks mate Sad
Could you be given an extra 30 minute / 1 hour time considering your health condition ?

deathevokation a écrit:
I think I preffered having the lost souls descend from the bars in the one trap to be honest, because they're ghosts so they can move through things. Razz
Oh okay Smile
Fine then, but I believe this trap would be a bit too easy with only Lost Souls and a HK + Demon.
Maybe you could then replace the Chaingunner with a Revenant... ?
Revenants on upper tiers + HKs on the floor is always a nice setup, I think.


_________________
Un peuple qui élit des corrompus, des renégats, des imposteurs, des voleurs et des traîtres n'est pas victime !
Il est complice.

George Orwell
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deathevokation


Nombre de messages : 263
Localisation : The Putrefying Road in the Nineteenth Extremity
Clan(s) : ( Aucun )

Map 21 - Chapel of Ghouls (by Adrian Hanekom, Rauno Marks and [WH]-Wilou84) - Page 2 Empty
MessageSujet: Re: Map 21 - Chapel of Ghouls (by Adrian Hanekom, Rauno Marks and [WH]-Wilou84)   Map 21 - Chapel of Ghouls (by Adrian Hanekom, Rauno Marks and [WH]-Wilou84) - Page 2 EmptyVen 08 Mai 2015, 23:16

That sounds really evil, haha... I'll try it. Smile

Thanks again for helping me with the map, btw!
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deathevokation
Cacodémon
deathevokation


Nombre de messages : 263
Localisation : The Putrefying Road in the Nineteenth Extremity
Clan(s) : ( Aucun )

Map 21 - Chapel of Ghouls (by Adrian Hanekom, Rauno Marks and [WH]-Wilou84) - Page 2 Empty
MessageSujet: Re: Map 21 - Chapel of Ghouls (by Adrian Hanekom, Rauno Marks and [WH]-Wilou84)   Map 21 - Chapel of Ghouls (by Adrian Hanekom, Rauno Marks and [WH]-Wilou84) - Page 2 EmptySam 20 Juin 2015, 18:19

Hey.... I'm sending an update and made a few changes. Smile

Highlights:
* moved the map to slot 22 to make Franck's life easier.
* added some more rockets in the level... not too much, but I think the final encounter might be a bit too hard without them because the monsters don't die quick enough with just the plasma rifle IMO, and suddenly the archviles enter the room and you're dead. As is I don't think someone will survive this encounter without prior knowledge. But I just might suck, so I need opinions from the rest of the team? Maybe an extra five seconds before the archviles enter the room and/or I remove the rockets, or what? Razz
* some aesthetic changes; mostly small changes that probably only I'll notice.
* new track taken from Crucified Dreams, makes the map a lot more atmospheric and haunting. I'm sure you like it, Wilou. Smile
* I added a few balancing changes and other adjustments that I can't remember, too many small petty things that I'd forget the next day. Razz

Have a good weekend, everyone. Smile
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[WH]-Wilou84
Rêveur perpétuel
[WH]-Wilou84


Nombre de messages : 30876
Age : 39
Localisation : Paris, France

Map 21 - Chapel of Ghouls (by Adrian Hanekom, Rauno Marks and [WH]-Wilou84) - Page 2 Empty
MessageSujet: Re: Map 21 - Chapel of Ghouls (by Adrian Hanekom, Rauno Marks and [WH]-Wilou84)   Map 21 - Chapel of Ghouls (by Adrian Hanekom, Rauno Marks and [WH]-Wilou84) - Page 2 EmptySam 20 Juin 2015, 20:47

Thanks Adrian !
I've just played the map, and I like the changes you made Smile

deathevokation a écrit:
Highlights:
* added some more rockets in the level... not too much, but I think the final encounter might be a bit too hard without them because the monsters don't die quick enough with just the plasma rifle IMO, and suddenly the archviles enter the room and you're dead. As is I don't think someone will survive this encounter without prior knowledge. But I just might suck, so I need opinions from the rest of the team? Maybe an extra five seconds before the archviles enter the room and/or I remove the rockets, or what? Razz
Yeah this little fight is supposed to be a bit brutal... Necromantic Thirst needs these moments, so that the player gets a good kick in the teeth sometimes. Wink
You're supposed to deal with the last couple remaining Revenants when the Viles open the door, you still have some time to hide / switch to RL but yeah it can be tricky.
We're still very far from, say, Stardate 20X6's difficulty level though.

I think you're right, adding some more rockets is the best decision here. Let's be a bit merciful.
Besides, the room is tight so rockets will take some skill to be put to good use.

deathevokation a écrit:
* some aesthetic changes; mostly small changes that probably only I'll notice.
Hehe, I see you switched back to using the FWATG1 floor texture in your section, sorry for changing it then !
The reason why I changed this one was because it's supposedly a tech texture ( some slime under a glass / plexiglas transparent floor ) and felt out of place to me. But it's fine this way too.

deathevokation a écrit:
* new track taken from Crucified Dreams, makes the map a lot more atmospheric and haunting. I'm sure you like it, Wilou. Smile
Yep, cool track ! Fits in very well.
I assume you didn't get word from PRIMEVAL then, though ?

Have a good week-end as well, and thanks again for your dedication !

_________________
Un peuple qui élit des corrompus, des renégats, des imposteurs, des voleurs et des traîtres n'est pas victime !
Il est complice.

George Orwell
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